The Commander Series Forum

This came up in a game last night.

First situation: An HQ (say, CV 9) has 4 units under its command. One of the units is in rugged terrain (-1 CV penalty), another unit is farther than 20cm from the HQ (-1 CV penalty), and the other two units are in open terrain within 20cm of the HQ. If the HQ wishes to activate all of the units, what is the penalty? Is is a -1 because no unit is in more than a single -1 situation? Or is it -2 (cumulative of the adverse penalties)?

Second situation: Same as above. But the HQ decides to activate the two normal units. So, after that order, one unit is -1 because of the terrain, one is -1 because of the distance to the HQ, and the two who were just activated are -1 because of the first order. Can the HQ now activate all four (I suspect not)? But, if it can, is the penalty -1 because all the units are in a -1 situation? Or -2 because the two previously unactivated units are in a -1 situation AND the HQ is issuing a subsequent order? Or a -3 for the two adverse conditions AND the subsequent order?

1. Penalties are cumulative, so it is -2

2. The HQ must finish issuing orders to the two normal units before it can start issuing orders to the other units.

Thanks, Pete; that's exactly what I expected. Just one more clarification on the first situation, then.

Since penalties are cumulative, if I had one unit on rugged terrain, another unit more than 20cm from the HQ, one unit in open terrain within 20cm, and the last unit was also in rugged terrain, would the modifier be a -3 because there are three units in adverse conditions? Or would it still be a -2 because there are two adverse conditions irrespective of how many units are affected by those conditions? (I suspect the latter.)

The latter - one modifier per condition

Thanks, guys. I appreciate the help (and the patience with my silly questions).

I don't understand the first question really,

in the first exaple he commands all 4 units. in the second command he does the same like I read it, isn't it? I mean, the 1st and second example are not different so he asks the same question. Am I right?

then my question: If you have 4 units in your command, and your 1st order you use to issue only 2 of them, you can't command all 4 of them in your second roll? so the formation you chose for your 1st command (the 2 units), must be completed giving orders before you can alter the formation?

If you order only 2 unit in the next order you cannot add unit but eventually to take out some units ( in your ex. one of two), then in a successive order you can order the other units with the max CV but you cannot re-order for the first two units.

Okay, so I've got those first two situations resolved. Thanks for the help.

Now, I have one additional question.

We've been playing that, when an HQ issues an order to its formation, the units can do varied things. One unit could fire, another move, etc., all as part of that single order.

What happens when the CO/HQ directs mortar fire? Can the CO/HQ issue an order (which we call an activation), have some units do movement, some do firing, AND as part of that same order, himself direct the first of the battalion mortars?

Or, if the CO/HQ directs mortar fire, can he not activate other units with that same order?

he can direct mortar fire AND make other units move or fire in one single command.

And the distance between mortars and HQ can be over 20cm.
without penalty.

Thanks, gentlemen. I appreciate all the insight.

A question about the second iizbrand situation.

hQ (CV8) order first only the 2 units in open terrain (U1,U2) .To order the 2 others one (in rugged terrain U3,and distance U4)) , it must complet the order of (U1,U2).What does it mean ? Its orders are completed until the order test is failed , or it must start the order of (U3,U4) before failing ?

When start to order (U3;U4) , the test should be lower than 6 (cumulative restriccion).In the secund order , both units are now in open terrain , so the test sould be higher than 7.

In the 3° order, they are both in a rugged terrain ,so the test should be , CV8 -2(3°turn) , (-1) rugged terrain.

thank you for your help , the forum is very helpfull.

"hQ (CV8) order first only the 2 units in open terrain (U1,U2) .To order the 2 others one (in rugged terrain U3,and distance U4)) , it must complet the order of (U1,U2).What does it mean ?"

It means that when the HQ finishes giving orders to U1 and U2, those two units cannot do anything else for the rest of the turn. That is, an HQ can keep giving orders to a set of units until you either fail a command roll or you change the HQ to give orders to another set of units. If the HQ changes to another set of units, its command value resets (minus applicable command penalties of course).

super clear.

utlimate question siggian ,

this explanation is your interpretation of the rules or the spirit of the rules. that doesnot appears so clearly in the rules.
I played my first game against a expermiented player . the rules were quit diferentes.Other interpretation.
We play U3 and U4 in the 2° turn with U2 and U1 because the Cv was the same.
CV8 -1 (2°turn) for U1 and U2
CV8-1 (for U3 and U4).

Hi, John, how's it going? I didn't know you were on this forum or played BKC.

For the trivia inclined, my user name is the name of my tank when I commanded C Co, 4/37 Armor at Ft Riley a LONG time ago. John took command of a great bunch of troops after me.

Joe

Formation is an overloaded term in the rule book.

The first meaning is the units assigned to an HQ before the game starts. This meaning doesn't have any effect on countries with flexible doctrine but it does for normal and rigid doctrines. Normal HQs trying to order a unit not in this formation get a -1 penalty. Rigid HQs cannot give orders at all.

The second meaning is the group of units that are being given an order just before the command roll. The two formations may or may not be the same. So, before the first command roll, you designate the "command" formation. After the first roll, you cannot add units to the 'command' formation, which is what your other player was doing. (We allow you to drop units from the "command" formation but these units cannot do anything else for the remainder of your turn.) The HQ can keep issuing commands to the "command" formation until you either fail a command role or the HQ moves on to create a different "command" formation.

It make command a bit tricky. You can group everything into one formation and have the whole lot do something but penalties might make this a risky thing to do. Or you can chunk into several smaller formations that might make activation easier but you risk blowing a command roll and not doing something with some of your units.